Disclaimer






"I am a BLOGGER NOT an expert. This is a BLOG not a 'go-to' website for official information. I represent no one's view save my own. I have neither legal nor financial training, nor do I have anything to do with the real estate industry. My understanding of the Collective Sale Process is from a layman's position only. My calculations, computations and tables are homespun and may contain errors. Please note that nothing in this blog constitutes any legal or financial advice to anyone reading it. You should refer to your lawyer, CSC or financial adviser for expert advice before making any decision. This disclaimer is applicable to every post and comment on the blog. Read at your own risk."
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There is one thing worse than an Enbloc ----- and that is an Enbloc done badly. Since the majority have the necessary mandate to sell, then they owe it to all SPs to make a success of it. Minority SPs can only watch and wait, if they sell then lets pray it's at a price we can move on with, if they don't sell, then we are happy to stay for a few more years.

Tampines Court Not Quite Sold

https://www.srx.com.sg/singapore-property-news/39972/s970m-for-tampines-court

Was there only one bid??? Name of buyer already leaked in the above link.
 (I am struggling to write this on a tiny phone screen overseas with iffy wifi)

"these conditions include completing the new development within 5 years of the collective sale order granted by STB or Court. The successful bidder of TC will also factor in the expected increase in DC rates come Sep 1....."

The 5 yr completion deadline is a complete red herring, as these rules do not apply to local developers. There are also loopholes developers can use to bypass the ABSD , namely delisting from the Stock Exchange or bulk buying unsold units. According to a TC resident, Sim Lian Group is a well established local developer formerly listed on the Main Board of the Stock Exchange of Singapore but was privatized and delisted from SES w.e.f 1 Nov 2016. (Thanks for that info TC Owner Guna).

I don't think the height restriction will be an issue seeing how this potential Buyer is well acquainted with Tampines & Simei, having built The Premier, Centrale 8, Tampines Trilliant and Parc Lumiere@Simei. They cannot claim ignorance and make building to 36 floors a condition.

Tampines Court has already gotten  CAAS (Civil Aviation Authority of Singapore) approval to build up to 49 AMSL - that's the same as My Manhatten in Simei and all the buildings that are in our area.

Since there was only one bid, Sim Lian will have the upper hand in negotiation. They could have multiple conditions and exit clauses.

I know nothing more about the details, just what was said in the media.
The bid was very near the RP. ( surprise surprise)

The Sale Price is low vis a vis the recent Hudc collective sales, we really cannot drop to anything lower should their conditions not be met.

Let's hope the team has the strength to reject anything lower.  It's already a disappointment.

71 comments:

  1. Hutton is so terrible, charging 1% or 9.6m in total.
    Whereas, Eunos only paying $5000 to OrangeTee

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    1. It may be on the high side, but this was approved at the point of their appointment. The 80% approved it again when they signed the CSA. This is a non-issue now.

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  2. Waking up to hard reality.

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  3. The value of your product lies in the perception of buyer's, not that of the seller.

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    1. This comment has been removed by the author.

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    2. Not really.The value of a product is determined by both the buyer and seller. If the value of a product rests solely on the perception of the buyer, then it would be redundant for the seller to quote any price. For example,the buyer might as well set the prices for all the products sold in the shops and the shops/companies would not have any say.

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    3. Really amusing, ownself sell to ownself ?

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  4. The result of this tender clearly shows one thing - we may think TC can fetch a high price with all its "positive" points, but as long as it makes no financial sense for developers to bid, they would not come in. Developers know all the technical details like what are allowed or not. They don't need marketing agent or anyone to tell them that, as they would have done their own research since they are going to spend millions of dollars into this.

    It's not a disappointment to me. Be grateful there is at least one bid. If this deal can be closed, we can get the money and reinvest in other things that would have given more returns in the coming years instead of sitting on a depreciating asset.

    If this deal does not go through, TC can forget about going for another enbloc attempt with a higher RP as everyone know the current bid price is the higher limit a developer is willing to pay, with conditions.

    Cheers!

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  5. A wake up call for many. Welcome to the reality!

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  6. They should call this deal off.

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  7. Too slow to act still waiting for more HUDC enbloc to compete.

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  8. Let us not be greedy but be realistic .It is obvious that for some reasons unknown to us , many developers are not very keen on TC . It is now or never .
    Please join hands to close the offer .

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  9. Based on the articles I've read, I get the impression only one bidder was above the RP and only by a minimal amount.

    Based on the other recent en-bloc sales going above the RP by significant amounts then something surely has gone wrong? Especially with these additional demands.

    What would be interesting is a table of actual valuation v actual sale for all recent enblocs to see how close the RP's have been to the valuations done at the sale. I'm still correct to assume that we need to pay for an independent valuation before we can sell?

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    1. The CSC have posted a notice stating the bid exceeds the independent valuation. Has anyone seen this independent valuation?

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    2. it was in the hutton office reveal of the bids. Someone shared it then.

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  10. Bigger and in a less desirable location it's only normal that the price will be lower. Making direct comparisons to other HUDC sales is pointless.

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    1. Well said sharp to the point !

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    2. Being bigger works both ways and hence has its advantages as well. It would be strange that the total cost of a much bigger piece of land is only just slightly higher than the total cost of a smaller piece of land. Whether the location is less desirable is debatable considering the facilities around the area. It is true that comparisons with other HUDC sales may not not yield total 100% accurate results due to some variations in nature and circumstances of each sales, but there are enough similarities between TC sales and the other HUDC sales for the comparisons to be valid.

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    3. What unique facilities do we have that others don't really have easily ? Dun be such a fool ?'

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    4. Bigger land size = bigger risk = lower price. The close proximity to an expressway and airport just add to that. Many people simply treasure a quiet living environment more than saving a couple of minutes commuting.

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    5. Anyway, 1.7m is still a very good price that gets you much more than TC.

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    7. Eunosville was also situated closely to the mrt station and expressway so it wasnt that quiet either

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    8. there could be a joint bid between 2 developers to pool their resources together, thereby lowering the risk. Since more houses can be built on a bigger area, it could also mean greater sales returns. Land is limited so it is likely that after redevelopment the apartments will still sell. Its in the papers that there are more developers than land parcels.

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    9. It is true 1.7m is still good. However it does not mean that those supporting the sales has the right to try to force their opinions and will on others who dont by heckling them and attempting to disparage differing opinions.

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    10. TC has more accessibility to shopping malls such as tampines mall, the new tampines hub, simei etc. as well as transport such as the upcoming downtown line. Eunosville does not have as good of an accessibility. Within the estates themselves, facilities in TC is certainly not behind those in Eunosville. But yet there is such a great difference in individual profit margins. Even taking into consideration TC is much larger than Eunosville, the disparity is far too great.

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    11. Pls measure distance of TC from city , pls zoom out n see BIg picture . Big ppl see big picture lol

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    12. the fact that you made a personal attack in your first comment just goes to show that you are too immature to partake in such discussions

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    13. Serangoon ville and Rio Casa are all located a great distance from the city as well.

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    14. I think this arguement is moot. Both of you are arguing from a layman perspective. This is an open bid, where any developers are allowed to big. The fact that others sites are getting so much bids vs ours in an open bid, and in an optimistic market, shows that if we continue to hold on. it will just get worst for us.

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  11. Don't know what the conditions are yet so can't assume it is sold.

    But we can admit is we have made a fundamental mistake in our assumptions somewhere to think that we could get 700-900 psf ppr.

    There could be many reasons including 1 Sept DC, large land size, height, queue of condos going enblocs, 5 yr period to complete sale etc etc. There is no point speculating anymore why. We have a bid now.

    Sim Lian (based on BT) knows Tampines area probably the best of all developers and they are likely the most creative in developing the area. They are also reputable and will not just put in a bid for fun. I only wish them all the best for a successful development and for seeing the potential of TC in a way other developers did not.

    I think this is a good solid bid and depending on the conditions, I would accept it. The market has already spoken. There is only 1 bid above RP. The market is never wrong. And our timing is excellent (look at the long queue of HUDC waiting for enbloc).

    I hope we can come together now and close this, and move on.

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    1. There are still 69 years left on the lease. Why do we have to be in such a hurry ? Im not saying that we should wait right until the end or that we should pass up a good opportunity should it arise. But i really dont think that this is the best deal we can get.

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    2. Use money to invest in better deal if you think market consensus is wrong giving you poor a deal, rather than "hope" for gold from sky.
      Do you know meaning of opportunity cost of time? Go google la!!

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    3. Likewise, ours is not freehold, the older it is, the developer know the less its worth.

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  12. TC is in a good location. Unfortunately it faces intense competition and its large land size is a net negative in this cooling measure environment due to the 15% Land price penalty if new development not constructed and FULLY sold in 5 years. A developer with one $billion appetite has many choices. It's a location/value proposition/risk-reward matter. A single bider simply means the big boys think they can find better deal elsewhere to spend $1billion...it's unfortunate similar billion dollar site like normanton park, Laguna park, lagoon View etc are in the pipeline

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  13. time to move on ...... $1.7 today better than $1.7 10 year later !!! Use today's $1.7 cash n invest wisely . If Trump starts a war or the Dow collapsed will be back to square 1.
    cheers

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  14. I realise from yesterday's tender opening that very few SPs really read this blog or fb page. Things are spread through word of mouth hence there were so many people yesterday.

    all the discussion on this blog or fb is really pointless since the same old people with the same old anti/pro enbloc views are reading it, and noone will change their minds anymore.

    No much further to say, just wait for the conditions to be announced.

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  15. I accept this price. It's now or never.

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  16. The winning bid is at the Reserve price. The $10M difference over reserve price is simply to pay Huttons.

    A single bid. The 'market' is a single bid.

    When all the other en blocs this year have received multiple bids. And the winning bid is between 15% ($300k) to 30% ($600k) higher per unit for en blocs this year. And lower than Shun Fu last year. Yes, we are the low water mark.

    Bewildered.

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  17. Dbs research just sent out an analysis real estate reaserch report on TC. If you arent convinced DBS is a impartial third party then nothing will. Will explain why only 1 bid.

    https://www.dbs.com/aics/templatedata/article/generic/data/en/GR/082017/170816_insights_third_time_lucky_for_tampines_court.xml

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    1. A very poor article, just parroting what other websites have said in the past. Nothing new. I doubt if the developer is going to build just a single 2600 unit condo to be sold all at once. It is much more likely that the site will yield up to 3 different condos with staggered TOPs - like the Waterfront collection. The units will sell easily, being well positioned and in a very popular Heartland. This is the second time they have bid for TC...( first time was in Rd 1).

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    2. Alamak , u could have been among singapore top riches property tycoon with such insight , none of them even bother to bid at least above RP? heaven really no eye !

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  18. I feel your pain but in reality, it is a good price!

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    1. Yes, many agree with you. Like I said, its a good and done deal. Take the money and lets move on with our lives...from a minority SP.

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  19. Agreed that the price is good given that this bid is by Sim Lian as reported by BT. The fact that TC has not attracted a single bid from the big players and Chinese developers is quite clear that they don't think new units to be built will "sell easily" and they can make a lot of money out of it. It is obvious they have better choices out there. These developers know the market much better than anyone here. So to those still dreaming that TC can fetch a better price than other enblocs, time to wake up and face the reality.

    Quickly get the deal close, take our money and invest in other places. It has been a long wait for many SPs to see our enbloc to this stage. How many years do you need to save to get $700k to $800k?

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  20. just be thankful Sim Lian put in a bid above RP. there may be conditions, so we shall see.

    People including the blogger who thought it would be much more bidders and higher price based on what happened in last 2-3 weeks, it just shows easily everyone can get blindsided.

    this is a dose of medicine to be Humble and recognise that own views are not always correct even if we shout and say it 1000x.

    I accept the bid. I dont let my ego take over. Hundreds of thousands of non -SPs are envious of us and would take this and go.

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    1. You say "hundreds of thousands of non-SP are envious". On what basis are you able to obtain that figure? Or is it based on assumption?

      "a dose of medicine to be humble and recognize that own views are not always correct". Oh, the irony.

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  21. Housing prices have been more or less stagnant for the past 2 years or so. Good to cash out now before the overpriced land sales and enbloc properties hit the market.

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  22. Anyone has any idea what are the conditions that come with the offer ?

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  23. When seemingly like whole property developers shun TC especially when the market is deemed hot, please ask yourself who are non-professionals whether your views are realistic

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    1. This. it will only get worst as time goes by. its a wakening call.

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  24. On the table is already 1.7m. If we don't grab it now, hoping for higher price later, it's too big a stake & risk to bet on. I think we should take the money & run.

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  25. There doesnt seem to be a call for SPs to approve anything during the next meeting? What does that mean?

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    1. The LTSA SP meetings are one way. No provision for SP voting on the matter was provided for in the CSA ...... us 'nuisance' SPs who see the need for such safeguards are always ignored. Anyway, the deal will be signed and sealed by the 25th with whatever 'conditions' and all owners can do is applaud or complain. I would imagine Sim Lian has a few exit clauses up it's sleeve.

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    2. Read your CSA. Powers of the CSC and things that need further SP consent should be spelled out in it.

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  26. Just because only 1 man show up for the matchmaking session doesn’t mean you have to marry your daughter to that man. The fact that only Sim Lian showed up means the outreach by the agent has not been far and wide…so much for their ‘contacts’ and marketing efforts or lack of- Low budget last minute student video project about TC…that misses the critical points altogether and to think we are paying them 1%! Blogger was critical about the matchmaker right from the get go…now I beginning to see her point. Sim Lian knows the tampines market well and knows what a gem TC is…so not much persuasion needed for them to put their name into the hat….other developers would definitely need more persuasion considering the size and quantum…mere contacts cannot cut it. Besides the matchmaker, there are many things to blame for the predicament we are in…north korea…etc ;the last thing to blame is the plump land which TC sits on…do not be fooled by the matchmaker who keep saying your daughter is fat and ugly and be thankful got people want to marry. TC is good for another roll of the dice….enbloc 4! Those who say that is either enbloc 3 or TC will never make it to enbloc 4 is a load of BS! That said,…looking at the number of senior citizens in TC during the meeting,..i think desperation will prevail this time round.

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    1. Do you really believe that developers will base their decision on whether to bid or not on some fancy brochure or video? Developers will be aware with or without a marketing agent and do their homework accordingly. The MAs main job is to convince SPs.

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    2. Count yourself lucky TC got a bid above RP. Keep reading this TC is a GEM thing... What GEM? It's Tampines. In front is PIE behind is HDB and MRT is some distance away... People who say TC is better than Eunosvilles is just so partial. Eunosville is downstep walking to MRT one MRT stop to Paya Lebar commercial centre and a few stops to Raffles City and CBD. I

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  27. Chill people! SPs are not involved in the process at this stage. THE TEAM DO NOT NEED TO CONVINCE ANYONE. They have been given the power to sign at or above the RP and that is what they will do. It's over bar the shouting.

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  28. 26: You are not a TC SP.

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    1. I am already warn you guys especially the blog owner that some of the noise makers are not TC SP and you all don't believe. Whoever he is, his objective is out to sabotage our enbloc. Remember divide & rule strategy? It is common tactics to get us to fight each other. He has not give up even at this stage. And this is the perfect place to attack our enbloc under anonimity. He dare not do it at offical FB because he knows his identity can be traced even under fake name.

      We need to be united if we want to see this round through !

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    2. Do u mean to say that only people that agree to sell at 1.7 is considered a TC SP?...those that disagree is not?..based on your definition, we have about 100 'non TC SP' TC SPs...interesting.

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  29. Pls don't be make personal rude attack to senior citizens being desperados !

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  30. True. CSC will act for the best interest of the over 82% SPs. Its a good n done deal. Lets move on with our lives

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  31. "I'm only rich because I know when I'm wrong."
    - George Soros

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  32. Lesson learned TC land is too big for developers to shallow is lucky one bidder accept the offer. Time to move on hope he don't back out.

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  33. It's quite surprising that people still think developers do not know what a "gem" TC is and more would have bid with a higher price if the MA did a better job. Big developers have been in this business for a long time. They know better than any MA on how much they can make in their investments. The only reason they are not bidding is because they have better choices for their investment dollars. Be happy with what you are going to get and let's hope to get this close asap so that every SP can get their money and move on with their lives.

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  34. To all SPs , pro or anti-enbloc , let us be humane and not be blinded by greed or personal selfish reasons . We should be magnanimous and abide by the law that allow the 80 plus % of SPs and SC members to decide for us on the developer's offer . 1.7 millions dollars are not a small sum compared to $900 k if you sell on your own .Please look at the gains and empathise with SPs who really need the extra money now that the opportunity has come. I especially appeal this request to those who plan to object .God Bless

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    1. On what ground can anyone object except financial loss. At this price is there any SPs losing money ? If they think they have other grounds, make sure they have a strong case to object & the money as legal fee is not cheap. Don't worry, I am confident this round will go through though we still have to look at the terms & conditions that comes with the offer.

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  35. I hope blogger can end this thread please. Very tired already.

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